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Uí Fiachrach Find: The "Lost" Uí Fiachrach Aidne?

Posted: Mon, 2021-Jan-04 2:54 am
by Webmaster
[This post was inspired by the research of Gráinne Ní Fhlannagáin, admin of the FTDNA Sons Of Aodh project, into the Y-DNA connection between her Flanagan family and the Fay surname.]

The Uí Fiachrach Find have been traditionally given a genealogy as a branch of the Uí Maini. Their territory was Máen Mag (Moenmoy), which is the rich plain around Loughrea. The Uí Maini have been given a genealogy as descendants of one of the Three Collas of Airgíalla, who in turn were given a Dál Cuinn descent. Recent Y-DNA studies of the traditional Cland Colla and Uí Maini surnames has shown all of this is incorrect. The Cland Colla surnames are showing up as R1b-Z3000+, which is part of a very early split from the line that became the Dál Cuinn (in the R1b-DF104 clade). The research for the Cland Colla can be seen on The Big Tree and Peter Biggins' excellent website.

Further, the Uí Maini themselves are not R1b-Z3000+, but are R1b-FGC6545+, which is part of a later split from the Dál Cuinn line prior to R1b-DF104. That also can be seen on The Big Tree. Interestingly, only the traditional Uí Maini surnames of Ó Cellaig (Kelly), Ó Madadáin (Madden), and Mac Trénfir (Traynor) have shown up so far as R1b-FGC6545+. The Kellys and Maddens are well known to be leaders of the Uí Maini kingdom in Connacht, while the Traynors are a well-known Airgíalla family. This tends to corroborate the record that the Connacht Uí Maini migrated from Airgíalla at some point in time. It also shows that Airgíalla was settled by 2 distantly related but distinct clades of people.

As noted, only the Kelly and Madden surnames are showing up so far. Other noted Uí Maini surnames are Ó Maíl Fálada (Mullally/Lally), Ó Nechtain (Naughton), and Ó Fothaig. The first 2 were the noted chieftains of the Uí Fiachrach Find. David Austin Larkin also notes in his Irish Septs: Surnames, Variants, Tribes, And Locations that there was an Uí Fiachrach Find Ó Flannacáin (Flanagan) family in Moenmoy and Eyrecourt.

In a brief aside, the origin for the Mullally surname does not appear to be from Máel Álaig/Álad, "devotee of virtue" rather than "specked chief" as Rev. Woulfe has it; but rather from Máel Fálad/Fálaid, "devotee of fences or hedges". This appears to be nonsensical, but if we look at Fálad as a typo for Fáelad, then we have "devotee of learning or teaching", which seems much more likely. This in turn raises the question as to whether the name Cend Fáelad, which is usually translated as "wolfish head", was rather originally "learned head". Regardless, this origin for the Mullally surname is derived from John O’Donovan's work, The Tribes And Customs Of Hy-Many, where on page 33 he translates as a partial genealogy for the Mullallys:
GENEALOGY OF THE O’MAEILALAIDH’S.

Amlaibh, son of Gilla Christ, son of Domhnall, son of Ceinneididh, son of Domhnall, son of Maelfhalaidh, a quo O’Maelfhalaidh, son of Cucichi, son of Maeltuili, son of Maclaeich, son of Connalach.
O’Donovan also gives a partial genealogy of the Naughtons on the same page:
THE CLANN AMLAIBH.

Nechtain son of Maelcheir, son of Aengus, son of Tuathal, son of Maclaeich, son of Connalach, son of Amhalgaidh, son of Deinmnedliach, son of Dima, son of Laidginn, son of Maeluidhir, son of Aedh, son of Finntan, son of Amhlaibh, son of Fiachra Finn, son of Bresal, son of Maine Mor.
In his Notes G and H, pages 174-183, O’Donovan gives more detailed genealogies for these 2 families, but raises copious questions as to their accuracy. On page 35, he gives a partial genealogy for the Cenél Fothaig of the Síl Maíl Anfuda and provides the following note for this family, in which he makes clear the later Ó Fothaig family in the area may or may not have any relation to the Cenél Fothaig cland, as surnames rarely duplicated cland names:
THE CINEL FATHAIDH HERE.

Cormac, son of Maenach, son of Ailibar, son of Colmn, son of Rechtamhail, son of Colman, son of Flann, son of Aengus, son of Uradhran, son of Fathadh, son of Aengus Loman.

The Cinel Fathaidh.—i. e. the race of Fathadh. Cormac, the last of this tribe mentioned in the pedigree, was the thirteenth in descent from Maine Mor (the common ancestor of the Hy-Many race), and must have been, therefore, contemporary with Oilioll Mac lnrachtach, who died chief of Hy-Many in the year 794 AD, and who was the same number of generations from the same Maine. It must not be supposed that hereditary surnames were in use at this time, nor is it even certain, though it may be possible, that the tribe here called Cinel Fathaidh, were the people whose descendants, after the tenth century, took the hereditary surname of O’Fathaidh. The family of O’Fahy, whether they be of this tribe or not, are still very numerous in the southern part of Hy-Many; the name is now generally Anglizised Fahy, without the O’; but in one instance the O’ is retained, and the remainder shortened to Fay. This, however, is not to be recommended, nor is the vile practice of translating the name to Green, from its resemblance to the Irish word faithche, a green or field, to be applauded.

It appears from the inquisitions taken in the reign of James I., that several branches of this family had then some fee simple property in the barony of Loughrea. An inquisition taken at Loughrea, on the 16th of September, in the year 1617, before Sir Charles Coote, finds that Teige Antlevy [i. e. of the mountain] O’Fahy is seized of fee of portions of Lishadoile, Kealuragh, and Cappaghard; that Teige O’Fahy and Edmond O’Fahy, his son, are seized of fee of a portion of the quarter of Knockanteige and Cappaghard; and that Edmond Uny O’Fahy, Edmond Oge Mac Edmond O’Fahy, Richard Mac Edmond O’Fahy, and Teige Mac Edmond Oge O’Fahy, were seized of fee of portions of Kealuragh, Lishadoile, and Cappaghard; and that John Mac Uny O’Fahy was seized of fee of portions of the townlands of Lishadoile, Cahercranilly, Garryblaken, and Ballinrowan, all in the barony of Loughrea.

There is a tradition in the barony of Loughrea, that the Earl of Clanrickard found it very difficult to get the O’Fahys to pay him tribute, their chief always telling the Earl that the lands he possessed were his own, and that the Earl had no claim on them.
So what do these Uí Maini families, particularly the Uí Fiachrach Find, have to do with the Uí Fiachrach Aidne? Well, firstly, they were located close to each other. On page 70, O’Donovan provides a description for the territory of Moenmoy:
Moenmagh.—O’Flaherty states (Ogygia, Part III. c. 17) that this territory, in which Loughrea is situated, is co-extensive with Clanrickard, in the county of Galway; but this cannot be true, as Clanrickard comprised the six southern baronies of the county of Galway, and Moenmagh never embraced any portion of the barony of Kiltartan, Longford, or Dunkellin. Moenmagh is the rich plain lying round Loughrea, and comprising Moyode, Finnure, and other places mentioned in old Irish documents. It was bounded on the east by the territory of Siol Anmchadha (now the barony of Longford [and territory of the Maddens]), on the south by the celebrated mountain of Sliabh Echtghe (now Slieve Aughtee), and on the west by the diocese of Kilmacduagh; its northern boundary is uncertain; but we know that it extended so far to the north as to comprise the townland of Moyode, as that place is distinctly mentioned as included in the plain of Moenmagh.
The territory of the Uí Fiachrach Aidne was co-extensive with the Diocese of Kilmacduagh, so Moenmoy was bounded on the west by the Uí Fiachrach Aidne. Further, one of the 2 major septs of the Uí Fiachrach Aidne was called the Cenél Áeda na hEchtghe. In his successor work, The Genealogies, Tribes, And Customs Of Hy-Fiachrach, O’Donovan annotates on pages 3-4:
Cineal Aodha na h-Echtghe.—This was the tribe name of the O'Shaughnessys of Gort Inse Guaire, in the south-west of the county of Galway, who were called na h-Echtghe, because their country comprised a portion of the mountainous district of Sliabh Echtghe, now called Slieve Aughty, and sometimes corruptly Slieve Baughta.
The Ó Sechnassaig (Shaughnessy) and Ó Cathail (Cahill) were the 2 chieftain families of the Cenél Áeda na hEchtghe. So again, Moenmoy abutted known Uí Fiachrach Aidne territory, this time to the southwest and south.

Further, in a note to this genealogy on pages 38-39 of The Tribes And Customs Of Hy-Many, O’Donovan writes:
PEDIGREE OF CINEL AEDHA.

Cubaga, son of Cellacli, son of Dungal, son of Congal, son of Cugusa, son of Ronan, son of Maelumha, son of Crimthann, son of Bresal, &c.

Cinel Aedha.—i. e. Race of Aedh or Hugh. There must be some mistake in the text here, as no Aedh is mentioned in the genealogy given, from whom the tribe could have been named.
This does lead to speculation about conflation with the Uí Fiachrach Aidne, Cenél Áeda na hEchtghe.

Now comes the Y-DNA. As stated above, only the Kelly and Madden surnames are showing up as R1b-FGC6545+. However, in the R1b-A1206 clade, which appears to be the Uí Fiachrach Aidne clade, there are 2 Shaughnessys, 2 Naughtons, one Fay, and 2 Flanagans. Further, detailed mutation testing has shown that one Shaughnessy, the one Fay, and the 2 Flanagans are in the R1b-FGC23739 subclade which is tentatively being identified as the Cenél Áeda na hEchtge. The one NGS tested Ó hEidin (Hynes) is in the parallel R1b-Y83043 subclade, so it is tentatively being identified as the Cenél Guaire clade. There is a second Hynes gentleman who has only tested to R1b-A1206+ so far.

One Naughton gentleman has done an NGS test, although only a first generation BigY, and is in the parallel R1b-BY135018 clade by himself. An updated NGS/WGS test could possibly move him to R1b-FGC23739, but that is only speculation for now. And as stated, there is a second R1b-A1206+ Naughton gentleman.

So we are seeing traditionally Uí Maini surnames appear in the R1b-A1206 Uí Fiachrach Aidne clade, where none of these surnames are noted as being Uí Fiachrach Aidne in any of the traditional sources; while none of these surnames are showing up with the Kellys and Maddens in the R1b-FGC6545 clade where they should be.

The Mullally/Lally surname is showing up primarily in the R1b-Y7082 subclade of the R1b-DF85 Uí Néill, Cenél Conaill clade, which does not fit anything. But it should be noted that all these men are Lallys. The one Mullally gentleman is by himself in the R1b-BY84482 clade, which so far is a mystery direct subclade of R1b-DF105. As such, it could be from any of the Connachta or their cousin lines. This would include any descendant of Fiachrae Foltsnáthach, although we think we have identified the R1b-FGC23742 clade as the descendants of Feradach Daithe and the R1b-BY35727 clade as the descendants of Amalgaid. But Fiachrae Foltsnáthach is credited with 5 sons in The Genealogies, Tribes, And Customs Of Hy-Fiachrach.

Also, there is a Gaelic given name of Lulach, which would become Lulaig in the genitive case and easily be an origin for Lally. There is no record of any Cenél Conaill origin for the Lally cluster, so it may be an unrecorded family. Another possibility is the Uí Fiachrach Find Mullallys were an SCE. However, the Lally surname so far being exclusive to R1b-Y7082, and the full Mullally surname being R1b-BY84482+, indicates the likelihood the Lallys are not Mullallys; with the caveat that the one Mullally could be an SCE himself. It should be well noted that O’Donovan himself in his Note H in The Tribes And Customs Of Hy-Many concerning the detailed Mullally genealogy scathingly excoriates the "official" genealogy.

The Uí Fiachrach Find were an unusual group. As O’Donovan translates in The Tribes And Customs Of Hy-Many, page 71:
And the king of Erin, strange to say, gives a subsidy to the chiefs of the Hy-Fiachrach Finn more than [or in preference to] the king of Hy-Many.
This is puzzling unless it was known that the Uí Fiachrach Find WERE Dál Cuinn and thus related to the Dál Cuinn High Kings. Further, the dynastic name itself is curious. On the same page as above, O’Donovan notes:
The Hy-Fiachrach Finn.—These were the branch of the Hy-Many seated in the territory of Moenmoy, mentioned in [the note about Moenmoy above]. Their chiefs were the O’Naghtens and O’Mullallys, or Lallys. They deduce their tribe name from their ancestor Fiachra Finn, the son of Breasal, who was the son of Maine Mor, the common ancestor of all the Hy-Many, as we learn from their pedigree in the Book of Lecan, fol. 90 (vide supra, pp. 32, 33), in Mac Firbis's Genealogical Book,p. 328, and O’Flaherty's Ogygia, Part III. c. 76, where we read, "Manii filius Bressalins quinque natos generavit, Fiachrium Fionn, ex quo O’Naghten, Dalianum, Conallum, Crimthannum, et Manium, a quo Hy-Maine Brengar."
But if we go to his The Genealogies, Tribes, And Customs Of Hy-Fiachrach, pages 8-9, he translates:
Eochaidh of the two plains, the son of Amhalgaidh, had a son Fiachra Fionn, from whom are descended the Hy-Fiachrach Finn, in Hy-Amhalgaidh, viz., the families of O'Congaile of Cill achaidh duibh, and O'Cathasaigh of Cill achaidh duibh also.

Cill Achaidh duibh.—called Cill Ardubh in other authorities. The place is now called Killarduff, and is a townland containing the ruins of an ancient church, situated in the parish of Dunfeeny, in the barony of Tirawley, and about a mile below the village of Ballycastle.
This has absolutely nothing to do with Moenmoy, but it does indicate the cland name of Uí Fiachrach Find did not apply to just a single group. From Dennis Walsh's Early Irish History and Saga website, we have:
Ui Fiachrach Finn - descended from Fiachra Finn, grandson of Maine Mór (a quo Ui Maine), this tribal name was noted in Moenmoy, county Roscommon (Tribes and Customs of Hy Maine, ed. O’Donovan). Ó Neachtain (O’Naghten, O’Naughton) and Ó Maolalaidh (O’Mullally) were noted as chiefs in this region prior to the Anglo-Norman invasion.

John O’Dubhagain in his Topographical Poems cites the sept of "O hEirc, over Ui-Fiachrach Finn," a reference to the territories of Airghialla (northern Ireland). The sept of O hEirc, chiefs of Hy-Fiachra Finn, were noted by O’Hart in the barony of Massarene, modern Co. Antrim. The Leabhar na gCeart cites Ui Fiachrach Finn in and around the parish of Ardstraw in Co. Tyrone, an area which has been equated with the Uí Fiachrach Arda Srátha (Ardstraw). There are other references to Ui Fiachrach in the Airgialla region, for example the Síl Ciarain of Ui Fiachrach are noted of Dún Da Én in Dail Araide and Síl Ciarain Ua nEchach of Airthir in Ulster (Book of Lecan).
So, we have Uí Fiachrach Find in Co. Galway, Co. Mayo, Co. Antrim, and Co. Tyrone at the very least. The point is that indicates it would have been very easy to conflate 2 different Uí Fiachrach Find groups in Co. Galway into a single one, or allow some other similar confusion to have occurred.

In conclusion, the Y-DNA data is by no means complete, and as such is not conclusive, but all the little hints in the traditional records, combined with the Y-DNA/surname correlations available to-date, give strong indication that the Uí Fiachrach Find were genetically Uí Fiachrach Aidne (the Mullallys still being unclear), regardless of how they came to be known as Uí Maini - through sloppy scribal work, deliberate genealogical grafting due to allegiance changes, etc. More data is needed, but in time a definitive picture should emerge.

Re: Uí Fiachrach Find: The "Lost" Uí Fiachrach Aidne?

Posted: Mon, 2021-Jan-04 3:52 am
by Mark Monroe
All,

This type of approach and analysis of the Y-DNA data, historical documentation, and family trees is what I love about this group! Thinking, analyzing, and adjusting the information without forcing the puzzle pieces to fit. Please keep up the great work and have a wonderful healthy 2021! Thanks for the contribution Grace!

Mark

Re: Uí Fiachrach Find: The "Lost" Uí Fiachrach Aidne?

Posted: Mon, 2021-Jan-04 7:06 pm
by flaniganw
Wonderful work...thanks for sharing!

Re: Uí Fiachrach Find: The "Lost" Uí Fiachrach Aidne?

Posted: Mon, 2021-Jan-04 11:14 pm
by Granuaile
David, thanks for all you do and putting this together, certainly much more coherently than I could have. I do think this is on the right track, though in the end the biggest problem is so few people have done even SNP testing, in the Fay and Fahy, in fact there are so few in their results and neither project lists surname or ancestry (https://www.familytreedna.com/public/Fa ... ycolorized and https://www.familytreedna.com/public/Fa ... ycolorized) and those that have done SNP testing, whose surnames may or may not be Fahy, are not where one might expect. I'm tempted to join this since the Fay (who isn't in either project as far as I can see) who matches my Flanagans only has 7 private variants between him and our shared SNP, BY183163 suggesting a common ancestor around 600 years ago (give or take a big margin of error, using 83 years per variant). Also many of them are matches for my Flanagan Fay Big Y match. What got me intrigued is the large number of Fays and Fahy/Faheys showing up and with DYS390=26 (which may mean nothing in itself but it is the predominant value for DYS390 among those under A1206 in the Sons of Aodh project). I'm hoping to persuade those who match my Flanagans to join SoA and let me test some or all for A1206)... That's the only way we'll know I think.

Re: Uí Fiachrach Find: The "Lost" Uí Fiachrach Aidne?

Posted: Tue, 2021-Jan-05 1:50 am
by Webmaster
Gráinne,

You are very welcome.

BTW, IDK if you noticed, but Green was a "vile" Anglicization of Fothaig, so you might also have a look in the Green project too. I will add all 3 to my checklist. And I did just check, but as you said, there is just not enough SNP testing in those projects, so no new discoveries.

As always, all we can do is wait for more data.

Re: Uí Fiachrach Find: The "Lost" Uí Fiachrach Aidne?

Posted: Tue, 2021-Jan-05 3:08 am
by Granuaile
David, I even joined those projects but not much there, and no activity feed. I did notice that about Green, and did check for matches to my Flanagans but not. I did take a look, and there are a few matches named Green, one at all levels (GD=0 at Y12 and GD=10 at Y110). They are probably almost all M222 at least, only one Fahey does not have the Niall badge...