Genelach Dáil Cuinn Project™ Forum

Geography brought me into taking a look at the Ui Briuin na Sionna after my recent research is pointing to a possible association of A5902>FT130287 with Clann Uadach of the Sil Muireadhach, which could be a reason for my clade ending up in Tir Maine. David told me (If I remember this correctly), that the Clann Uadach's original territory was on the Roscommon-side of the Shannon not far from the Doon of Drumsna (Leitrim), which could have been the site of some intermingling between Breifne kin-groups and Sil Muireadhach as they wouldve been practically amongst eachother for 3 centuries before Clann Uadach was positioned by Ó Conchubhair in Tir Maine to exert his authority over the Ui Maine. Looking at the history of the area, I found that the greater part of this area "between Elphin and Jamestown" was "Tir Briuin na Sionna", and part of the Three Tuathas, where Ó Manacháin (of Ui Briuin na Sionna) was chief until pushed out by Ó Birn in 1249. Both of these surnames are still heavily represented in Roscommon/Leitrim however no O'Monaghans show up in any A259+ downstreams, or even A18726 for that matter (unless they have emerged as the Mannions in TBT10109 who have an ancestor with the well-defined Cland Fergaile Ó hAllmuráins). And only one O'Beirn shows up under A10528 "Maicne Ernain" with O'Malleys. The rest of the Byrn/Burn are in A887 which occurred in 1200 among the Muintir Maelmordha in western Cavan. There are Bryans among another of the Breifne Ui Raghaillaigh clades that could also be O'Beirnes. Could all of these groups be more recent NPEs? or is there something largely fictitious about where the Ui Briuin na Sionna came from?
Both Ó Manacháin and Ó Birn are given Ui Briuin genealogies. It's said that the O'Beirns were Sil Muireadhach who "ousted" O'Monaghans, who were "na Sionna" although I can't confirm that. So it would seem that the Ui Briuin na Sionna may have come under Sil Muireadhach control in the 13th c or earlier and became vassals of O Conchubhair. Could the Clann Uadach prior to their placement in Tir Maine been performing the same duties for O Conchubhair among the Ui Briuin na Sionna at an earlier date?

H. Maenachan of Clann Ona mc. Aenghusa in the Book of Ballymote
H. Maenachan is one of the families said to descend from Ona m. Aenghusa m. Earca derg m. Briain m. Echach mugmedoin

Genelach hI Bern from An Leabhar Donn
Domnall ocus Uilliam Dondchad & Tadcc Cairpri & Feradach Dunadach & Rosa & In Gilla Dub clann Mailechlainn m. Briain m. Taidc m. Dondchada m. Domnaill m. Gillacrist m. Imair m. Gillacrist m. Mathgamna m. Gillacomain m. Imair m. Gillananaem m. Domnaill m. Gillacrist m. Conconnacht m. Muircertaig m. Ciaba Gorma m. Muircertaig m. Birnn m. Cinaetha m. Ubain m. Uatach m. Aeda bailb m. Indrachtaig m. Muiredaig Muillethain



There are certainly enough historical references to define the Ui Briuin na Sionna and their territories (at the very least the parishes of Aughrim, Kilmore, & Clooncraff in Co. Roscommon), but history only records two families ever associated with them, and possibly a third, the Mac Aodh. The Mac Aodh are associated with Aughrim, Co. Roscommon which was Eochraim-mic-Aodh, in Tir Briuin na Sionna, however they don't seem to be Ui Briuin either unless I just haven't come across any Ui Briuin McHughs.

AFM 866.
Flann, the son of Conaing, lord of all Bregia, was killed in the battle of Killoneery by Monaghan, lord of Hy-Briuin na Sionna, on which occasion a bard sung: "'How great was Monaghan's sway, How great his glory on that clay, When he cut off proud Conaing's head, And bore it off in triumph as it bled I In his red right hand, &c.,"
AFM 1145.
The Hy-Briuin (Breifne), with the party of Connacians, made an attack on the fleets of the Sil-Murray, and of the Tuathas, on which occasion Morogh O'Mulrenin, chief of the Clan-Conor, and Donogh O'Monaghan, lord of Hy-Briuin na Sionna, were slain
AFM 1159.
Murray O'Monaghan, lord of Hy-Briuin, of the Shannon, was killed at the battle of Ardee, which was fought between Roderic O'Conor and Maurice MacLoughlin, Monarch of Ireland.
"1196.
Iodhnaighe, or Ignatius O'Monaghan, Lord of Hy-Briuin, of the Shannon, died.
"1218. The English of Meath made an eruption into Hy-Briuin na Sionna, but were repulsed and defeated by the Hy-Briuins.
"1232.
The church of Kilmore, in Hy-Briuin na Sionna, was consecrated by Donogh O'Conor, Bp. of Elphin.
"1249.
Teige O'Monaghan, lord of Hy-Briuin na Sionna, died on the 16th of June, and was interred at Kilmore na Sionna.
AFM 1251.
The rain fell in such torrents in Hy-Briuin na Sionna that a large boat might sail through the Baile of Kilmore na Sionna.
"1342.
Hugh, the son of Felim O'Conor, and Donogh O'Beirne, chief of Tir-Briuin na Sionna, drove Torlogh O'Conor into the church of Elphin, when he went thither to obtain pledges for the reparation of the prey which O'Beirne's people had carried away from Rubert Burke."
"1398.
A party of the MacDermots proceeded to Aughrim Mae Aodh, in Tir-Briuin na Sionna.
" 1415.
Tomaltach, the son of Teige O'Beirne, was slain in a nocturnal aggression by Farrell, the son of Dermot MacRannal, at Cluain Sithe (Cloonshee, Clooncraff p.), in Baile Eile, in the house of Mac-an-Donnanaigh (now Denneny), where, also the daughter of Loughlin O'Hanley was burned.
" 1451.
The three sons of Melaghlin O'Beirne-Teige, William Lind Donogh-were slain at Cluain Creamha (Clooncraff) by the descendants of Melaghlin MacRannall and Donnell, the son of Brian O'Beirne.

The O'Beirne are first mentioned in 1342, well into the timeframe of A887. There are also scattered O'Brians among A260+ downstreams that could also be O'Beirne. Could the Ui Briuin na Sionna be a conglomeration of unrelated people like the Ui Maine? Or at least a scattering of Ui Briuin clades from all three major Ui Briuin kindreds? Did their geographic positioning between much two much more powerful families turn them into a genetic melting pot? It would somewhat explain why 3 of the Cenel Brenaind kin-groups of Breifne not only have no association with Breifne, but seem to have surname "footprints" in Machaire Connacht & Ui Maine.

Chris,

You have stumbled into one of the interesting mysteries - who are the Uí Briúin na Sinna? This is tied to who are the Corcu Achlainn and the Cénel Dubthaig (Dobtha)?
[ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_Tuathas ]

The typical genealogy you cited has all of them as descendants of Óno and his brother Dubthach (Dobtha):

Ona m. Aenghusa m. Earca derg m. Briain m. Echach mugmedoin [Uí Máenacháin]

Ona m. Aengusa m. Earca derg m. Briain m. Ecach mugmedoin. [Corcu Achlainn]

Dobhtha m. Aengusa m. Erca derg m. Briain m. Echac muigmedoin. [Cénel Dubthaig]

But this is an egregious conflation. The Tripartite Life Of St. Patrick, etc. clearly state:

Óno, son of Óengus, son of Erc the Red, son of Brón, from whom descend the Húi-Ónach, offered his dwelling to Patrick;...

Ercc Derg (Erc the Red) is the son of Brón, NOT Brión (Brian). These are two different names and were very much known to be so in the records of St. Patrick because one of his entourage was Bishop Brón; so the above is NOT a mere typo. H. T. Knox in his The History Of The County Of Mayo To The Close Of The Sixteenth Century says:

The Three Tuaths, Hy Briuin na Sinna, Corcachland, and Cinel Dobhtha, claimed descent from Erc Derg, son of Brian. But the Book of Armagh and the Tripartite Life make it clear that they came from Erc, son of Brón, of the Corca Chonluain. Descendants of the Erc from whom they came seem to be the Maicne Erc, sons of Heric, who were in Moylurg in St. Patrick's time. These appear to be the Hy Bróin, who where distinguished from Hy Briúin by Tírechán, who calls them [Filii] Briúin and Filii Bróin. Though they do not descend from Brian, it is not unlikely that the Corca Chonluain had a common ancestor with the Conmaicne, and so being of the royal race, were not under tribute, being included in the direct dominions of the King of Silmurray, as the Calry are omitted because immediately under the Hy Fiachrach kings, as I suppose. Beyond this we know not who were in possession of the rest of Magh Ai and of the Three Tuaths.

I have no idea who the Corcu Con Lúain were nor how Knox made the connection. He had his pet theories as to the origin of the Uí Briúin from the Conmaicne which the Y-DNA has proven to be egregiously wrong. But he did study the older, non Dál Cuinn tribes extensively. IDK his sources, though. Regardless, this also raises the question, should the territory have been named Uí Bróin na Sinna?

And I must completely disagree with Knox as to the origin of the Sons of Erc mentioned in The Tripartite Life, etc. They are noted as being in Moylurg, specifically near Boyle, around Assylin or the Eas Mic nEirc, the waterfall/cascade/cataract of the Sons of Ercc. All the evidence I have seen indicates that at the time of St. Patrick, the Uí Ailella territory extended from at least the Barony of Tirerrill, and possibly Sligo Town itself, in Co. Sligo on the north to around Elphin in Co. Roscommon on the south and from the River Shannon on the east to the territory of Airtech on the west. This includes Moylurg and POSSIBLY the territory of the Uí Briúin na Sinna, but as noted above, it MAY have been the territory of the Uí Bróin na Sinna.

Further, Bishop Maine was of the Uí Ailella.

And they went over the Shannon to Duma Graid...For he [St. Patrick] was among the descendants of Ailill. And he baptized holy Mane [Maine], whom bishop Brón son of Icne ordained, [and] who [Bishop Brón] is in Caisel Irroe [Killaspugbrone], a servant of God, a companion of Patrick.

Then Patrick went into the district of Mag Luirg [Moylurg], and his horses were forcibly taken by the tribe of the Sons of Erc, and he cursed the people of that country. But bishop Maine of the Hui-Ailella besought Patrick to forgive his brethren, and Patrick weakened the malediction.

So it seems almost certain that the Sons of Ercc in Moylurg were Uí Ailella and they were distinct from the descendants of Ercc Derg son of Brón whose territory appears to have been the Three Tuatha.

Another interesting thing is The Tripartite Life, etc. only mention Óno and his brother Ith (Id). There is no mention of a third brother named Dubthach (Dobtha) that I can find. So where did Dubthach come from?

I have been researching this subject for several years now, and part of this research is posted at St. Patrick And The Uí Ailella. This is a very complex subject that should garner more attention because the records of St. Patrick are the only semi-independent accounts of the early Connachta. Below is a link to a territorial map that is very much a work in progress. A side note is that I now wonder if Imgae Baislicce MAY have been Roscommon Town.
[ https://genelach.org/special/The_Tripar ... se_Map.png ]

Wow, I would have NEVER been able to figure that out So wedged between two Ui Briuin groups were an Ui Broin, the amount of strange coincidences in all this is wild. That is fascinating about the Ui Ailella going that far east, I wonder if there are Sil Muireadhach surnames popping up among them. That map is excellent, I remember you telling me you were using townlands.ie? what tools are you using to outline townlands?

Thanks again, David!

Chris,

I use a free image editor called PhotoFiltre 7 to stitch screenshots from townlands.ie together to make larger maps and also add borders, text, etc. PhotoFiltre has some nice editing tools like a "magic wand" that lets you select things by color and delete or change the color, etc. It also has layers so you can put borders on one layer, text on another, etc.

There is also a website that provides topographical maps using the same OpenStreet database as townlands.ie. I don't have the URL handy ATM, but here is a link to the topographical version of the other map.
[ https://genelach.org/special/The_Tripar ... po_Map.png ]

We do have some interesting surnames in the R1b-BY3338 Uí Briúin Bréifne, Maicne Áeda Find clade like Burns/Byrne/etc; Brian/Bryan/etc; Mulvany; Brennan; etc. This clade is predominantly Uí Rogellaig, but there are other surnames scattered in it like the above.

The R1b-BY20602 clade now gives strong evidence of being the Síl Muiredaig, e.g., the Mac Diarmata. But none of the surnames you are looking for has shown up there yet. But this has been a very slow clade to develop. It has only been within the last couple of years we have finally been able to see its structure. Of course, we also now know that families like the later Ó Conchobair were not Síl Muiredaig genetically. Finally recognizing that fact took the focus off the R1b-BY18120 clade as being the Síl Muiredaig and allowed us to see that the R1b-FGC5939 clade is the true Maicne Eócháda Tírmchárnai.

So while the genealogies are remarkably correct overall, there are some interesting discrepancies for select, specific families. Again, conflation and confusion are the main culprits for the divergences. The key is to NOT throw out the baby with the bathwater when studying the genealogies; which too many 20th century historians appear to have done. The emphasis shifted from the genealogies to the Book Of Rights. But in EÓL DAM SEISER CLOINNE CUINN, The fortunes of a 12th-century Irish syncretistic poem by Dr. Dáibhí Ó Cróinín, he includes the following:

In a contemporary criticism of Geoffrey Keating’s Forus Feasa ar Éirinn (written c. 1634) voiced by a member of the learned Ó Cléirigh family, Keating is taken to task for his acceptance of Leabhar na gCeart (the ‘Book of Rights’) as an authoritative source for early Irish history. The work, his critic declares, was not written by St Benignus, disciple of St Patrick (as it was claimed), nor by any trustworthy historian, and were better styled Leabhar na nÉccert (the ‘Book of Wrongs’) than Leabhar na cCert.

It has been my view about the Book Of Rights that it appears to be concerned with who owes what taxes to whom. The genealogies are about the who that gets to collect the taxes. Given human nature, I know which source I would trust more...

The Three Tuatha territory gets even more interesting when pulling in accounts of the ancient extent of the Uí Maini territory. I won't get into that here, though. But it seems crystal clear that the Doon Of Drumsna is the Duma Graid mentioned in The Tripartite Life, etc. where the Uí Ailella were; and that “while Patrick was biding at Duma Graid, ordaining the great host, he smiled...”.

Further, we have this description of his travel:

Patrick went to Mag Glass [from Duma Graid]. There he founded Cell Mór Maige Glaiss, and left therein two of his household, namely Conleng and Ercleng. Then he came into the territory of Corcu-Ochland to this side [the southern side] of the Hui-Ailella and to the north of [Mt.] Badgna.

Cell Mór Maige Glaiss appears to be in what became known as Tír Briúin na Sinna, but it is unclear as to whose territory it was at the time of St. Patrick. So the southern boundary of the Uí Ailella is somewhat vague; but the ownership of Corcu Achlainn is quite clear though - the Uí Bróin. One thing to note is that by context it would appear that the Uí Bróin were NOT an Attacotti/Aithech Tuatha/Déisi or vassal people. There are just so many tantalizing hints of early Connacht in The Tripartite Life. It is a shame we don't have more details.